Why were they called Saloon's?

[Bob Wood]

Why were drinking establishments in Southwest U.S. during the Old West period called Saloon's and not Bar's ? The term "Bar" was in use in other parts of the country so why not the Southwest?

[Stan H]

A pretty good question.

From Online Etymology (word origins):

saloon
1728, Anglicized form of salon (q.v.), and originally used interchangeable with it. Meaning large hall in a public place (esp. a passenger boat) is from c.1835, also used of railway cars furnished like drawing rooms. Sense of "public bar" developed by 1841, Amer.Eng.

It would be interesting to see how and why that name was used and not simply "bar."

Maybe it sounded a bit more elegant at the time?

[knuckles Mcdaniel]

bar were very limited in thier doings
a saloon provided entertainment Ie Music .singing ,women ,cards dice, billards, and other betting be side the liquide beverage they provided.

[C. F. 'Charley' Eckhardt]

Now, just for the fun of it, why do the Brits call a sedan a 'saloon?'

[C. F. 'Charley' Eckhardt]

The 'bar' is the wooden fixture inside the saloon, behind which the barkeep makes or pours the drinks or draws the beer. The mirrored section behind the barkeep is the 'back bar.' The 'rail' is the brass or wooden rail where you put a foot while drinking. Caution--if your boot soles are wet & you want to light a smoke, do not put your foot on a brass rail while using the saloon's electrically-ignited cigar lighter. You might say it's an 'uplifiting' experience.

[Jeff Smith]

Bob, I have not noticed the term saloon applied to only one section of the country and don't recall ever seeing the term bar used in place of saloon until well into the 1900s. I did, however, see the name grill used in Seattle instead of saloon in 1896.

[C. F. 'Charley' Eckhardt]

A grill would serve hot food, cooked to order. The 'free lunch' in a saloon consisted of very salty items that would cause the patron to buy more than 1 beer. I have a 'nickel beer' mug from my great-great grandmother's restaurant, hotel, & saloon in New Orleans. It's called a 'Templar's Good Pony' & it holds about a quart.

[Bob Wood]

In the book, "Saloons of the Old West", by Richard Erdoes the term saloon didn't replace the terms; tavern, alehouse and taproom until the 1840's and the typical western saloon didn't appear with its false front, carved bar, and swinging doors until the 1850's. These things distinguished a saloon from all the other drinking establishments. One other difference, Saloons were a - Men's only place - and respectable women were not allowed. The other kind of woman was encouraged.

Erodes writes, " Thus the image created by legend and Hollywood which comes invariably to the American mind whenever the word "saloon" - meaning Western Saloon - is mentioned."

Maybe that's why I think of just Southwestern United States when I think "Saloon".

Erodes uses the term "Bar" when mentioning San Francisco in 1851. In the next paragraph he uses the term "Saloon" when talking about cattle drives, railheads, Dodge and Abilene.

[Stan H]

Why were they called saloons?

Maybe because if the called them churches no one would come in,,,,,lol

Joking aside, in "Cowboy Life, the Letters of George Phillip," the author points out that saloons were "men's clubs" where the locals could all gather to discuss events of the day, range conditions, the market, etc. All this without the interference of their wifes (no offense intented to our lady memebrs here). In South Dakota, as in most western towns, the saloon was usually one of the first buildings to be set up, even if sometimes those "buildings" were nothing more than a canvas tarp spread over a plank set up between two barrels.

The Deadwood Gulch community had over 70 saloons within the first year of existence.

Sorry for getting off topic. It is just that the whole saloon issue is interesting to discuss.

[Bob Wood]

Stan,

I like that. That was funny. I'll bet if they called it Church and served beer they'd come.

[Bob Wood]

I found the following in Fred N. Holabird's book, " Collecting Guide to the Pioneer Minor Coinage of American Saloons":

Definition of Saloon - A spacious and elegant apartment for the reception of company or for works of art; a hall of reception, esp. a hall for public entertainments or amusements; a large room or parlor; as, the saloon of a steamboat. Popularly, a public room for specific uses; esp., a barroom or grogshop; as, a drinking saloon; an eating saloon; a dancing saloon.

That pretty much sums it up and it only took one word to say all that - SALOON.

[Jeff Smith]

A wonderful definition Bob.